Breaking: Cavs Trade Kyrie Irving to Celtics
2017-08-22
The Cavs pulled the trigger on a Kyrie Irving trade, just a few weeks after he informed owner Dan Gilbert he wanted out of Cleveland. Gilbert apparently found a willing trade partner in the Boston Celtics, who traded Isaiah Thomas, Jae Crowder, Ante Zizic and the unprotected 2018 first round pick that the Celtics still had from their trade with the Brooklyn Nets.
Cavaliers Agree To Trade Kyrie Irving To Celtics For Isaiah Thomas, Ante Zizic, Nets' 2018 FRP: https://t.co/BT9epYRczR pic.twitter.com/NIlMu20e13
— RealGM (@RealGM) August 22, 2017
The Cavs had been on the prowl for a deal that featured a top PG in return, a wing defender and either a young player with upside or high draft pick. This deal technically ticks all of those boxes. There was much speculation that the Cavs really wanted 2017 first round pick Jayson Tatum, but apparently Boston sweetened the deal enough with Zizic and the unprotected Nets pick for 2018.
Thomas has one more year remaining on his deal, and Crowder has three on a very cap friendly deal. Zizic is a 6’10 big man who was a first round pick in 2016 for the Celtics but played in Europe last season.
Chime in to share your thoughts on this blockbuster deal… and appreciate the irony of this Tweet…
The 1st player of the 2011 draft was just traded for the last player in the SAME DRAFT. pic.twitter.com/Aa08VeYbTN
— NBA on ESPN (@ESPNNBA) August 22, 2017
One thing I’m certain of. Celtics will not get passed Lebron and pissed off IT in the East.
I don’t like Rose, don’t like IT, but I think both moves make the Cavs better or at least the best of a difficult situation in the case of Kyrie. Crowder is a really nice pick-up.
Crawder + JR = ????
As for “Gilbert apparently found a willing trade partner in the Boston Celtics,” what makes you think Gilbert was working the phones trying to get a trade instead of Altman?
I’ve slept on the trade and I like it. Many times teams get nothing for star players (i.e., Indiana Pacers). We got a guy with about as high of a PER as LeBron (27.11 vs. 26.59). I understand this is just one stat, and many stats (like RPM) show IT isn’t great. But, the guy averaged 29 ppg and did so rather efficiently. He got to the rock 2x as often as Kyrie. Kyrie is the superior player, period. I’m not saying IT is the same. But, IT is going to be incredibly useful for us this season. IT+Rose at… Read more »
Also, look at what Chicago got for Butler, who also had 2 years left on his deal. Garbage.
It’s wild to see such a big trade with our main conference rival. To me, Kyrie’s dissatisfaction was largely personal. I mean, sometimes bands break up, because they just get sick of each other. The Beatles broke up, after all, with everyone in the world except Paul and John against it. The Cavs moved on and did what they could. It’s going to come down to the draft pick to know how it turns out. Certainly the Cavs didn’t fleece the Celtics given that Kyrie is a much better player than Crowder or IT. The good news is that they… Read more »
Everyone, except for Yoko and Linda, who caused it.
Agree that the conference rival trade is crazy. You never see that. I think there are 2 ways to think about it: (1) we said screw it, we don’t care who we face in the East, we are still better because we have LeBron+Love+others and Boston gives us the most value in return, OR (2) LeBron is leaving and we don’t care if Boston is great for the next 3-4 years because we will be rebuilding.
This seems to be a pragmatic trade under the challenging circumstances.
I agree with NOMAD. Yet, the Cavs need to get more athletic and younger to compete with the Dubs. The nexus for this is this upcoming season. Hopefully Shump will want to out-Crowder Crowder; there’s that.
That said, even if Kyrie is a unique offensive talent, I will not miss his ISO default mode and I still think the Cavs could have better figured out the” unselfish thing” in the finals last year. As a nominal point guard, Kyrie is a ball hog, so, good riddance.
We do have his Bird rights. If the fit is good we could max him out. Plus we’ll have a good take on how bad the Nets are by trade deadline.
I’d be pretty surprised if IT is in Cleveland past this season.
IT certainly has his limitations on defense, but they are physical more than effort based. On a team with James, Love, and Rose + lots of shooting IT’s load should be lighter which hopefully helps with wear & tear. Also he should get more efficient.
IT is a one year rental…. thought that was obvious.
YES!!! Kristaps and Noah for TT and a pick??? Get on the horn!!!
Cavs got their “blue” chip player. They picked up a smurf!!!!
I like the recovering leprechaun better…
???????
Very interesting….
Bad news for the Cavs, there are no players under 6 foot projected in the top 100 of the 2018 draft. We need to start scouting middle schoolers.
IT and Shump for Bledsoe!!!
Phoenix traded IT to Boston, remember?
Dress him up like Billy Manziel.
Son of a…dangit, I totally forgot about that. Sigh.
Bag it (the season) for Bagley!!!
Rudy Gobert just trolled IT with a retweet of his own recruiting tweet to Hayward earlier this summer… awesome
That is hilarious. I wish it wasn’t and that we got Tatum or Brown instead of Thomas. Oh well, C’est la vie.
Love it!!!
I think how the trade will work out for Cavs will depend on what Cavs will do with unprotected nets pick. By trade deadline, you will get a very good idea of how bad Nets record going to be in a top heavy draft. Tougher decision is to keep the pick for future or trade for an ageing(or disgruntled) all star. I don’t think you can get a young all star but you can get an ageing star for that pick. Isaiah, because he is a scoring guard and he can’t guard anyone would be an ideal sixth man on… Read more »
The pick is everything. Pretty much the only thing that matters in this trade, though Crowder is nice,
ya, at first glance, it looked like Kyrie for Isaiah but more and more we think, pick and Crowder are more of a gain for Cavs than Isaiah.
Agreed. IT off the bench could work. That’s about it. Truthfully, I think GS is going to have so much more bench shooting this year that IT won’t matter.
Emergency Podcast Just posted.
Woot
Thanks Nate!
Looks like we’re drafting some guy named Bagley: 2. Cleveland Cavaliers (via Nets) Marvin Bagley Duke Freshman PF/C Bagley is a fluid athlete with a natural feel for scoring, rebounding and blocking shots, which helps him post elite numbers at the high school and AAU level. He’s a terror in the open court and very difficult for opposing big men to stay in front of in one-on-one situations, getting him to the free throw line at an excellent rate. NBA teams will want to see how easily he’ll be able to make the transition to the intensity level of the… Read more »
Any relation to this guy?
No idea. I didn’t know he existed until I typed up 2018 NBA Mock Draft.
I’m old. I remember him very well as a college player. Boston College, wasnt it…
Yes, he was a very good college player at BC. Might have been Big East Player of the Year once or twice. Had his moments with the Cavs, but was traded away one season into the Lenny Wilkens era.
From what I recall, he was pretty tough taking it into the paint (in college)…hardly remember him with the Cavs…back then, I watched a metric ton of college hoops…
He’s a Duke guy!!! I LOVE IT!!! Coach K will make him play team ball!
So Pelton and SI gave the Cavs A’s. FTS thinks it’s great value. Cavs the blog the only place who thinks it sucks.
Maybe it’s time for this place to rethink this deal.
Then by all means, go somewhere else… seriously man… like a broken effing record all the time
Get outa my head…
FTS thinks every trade the cavs make is Grrrrreeeeattt, because hey, everything is AwEsome!!!!! What does Pelton as a stats guy think of IT? That would basically tell me whether he is full of it or not.
Go ahead, make your case. Don’t just argue from authority.
http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/058/911/GTFO.gif
Too many fanboys around here who worshop Cavs players and or Josh Jackson. We are starting 3 all stars plus JR & TT. A bench of Rose, Korver, Crowder, RJ, Green, Frye, Shump, & Calderon can all play usefull minutes. That’s 13. Throw in Osman (who I think will displace Calderon on the active roster) + Zizic/Tavares/Felder in the pipeline + the Brooklyn pick + potentially adding Wade mid-season?
We haver a legit shot. Plus, GSW will get too big for their britches. That will help.
You don’t like fanboys? See above…
GSW may win 70 games next year without really trying…
You are unrealistically high on IT based off three years of being exploited in the playoffs every year. He is objectively bad and also doesn’t pass the eye test. You cannot hide him in the playoffs. He cannot get a good shot off against most playoff defenses and likely won’t be able to consistently even with James. He will get more wide open js, but is not as good as a shooter as Irving. There are multiple advanced stats that show he is a net negative or at best a player whose defensive liability will always outweigh his offense. See… Read more »
The Cavs had IT’s numbers in all two playoff series against the Celtics in ’15 and ’17 but didn’t he have 53 points against the Wizards in the eastern semi-finals this past season? Who knows, perhaps having someone better than him on offense might unshackle his full potentials. He is definitely bad on defense, but the Celtics somehow hid him well enough to compete well against the Warriors – at least in the regular season.
celtics hid Isaiah with Avery as back court mate.
From the same Pelton to give context: Boston has matched up well with Golden State with Thomas at point guard, but largely because former backcourt-mate Avery Bradley allowed the Celtics to crossmatch defensively. Some of the defensive gain the Cavaliers make in a potential NBA Finals rematch with the Warriors is offset by replacing Irving with Thomas. Even if you don’t believe this trade makes Cleveland more likely to win the 2018 championship, the fact that it’s even debatable is a huge win for the Cavaliers. It’s unclear whether keeping Irving was realistic after his desire to get out of… Read more »
Thanks for the shot, but good riddance. Crowder can start, IT can come off the bench as 6th man. Lebron runs the point.
IT, Korver, Cedi, Frye and Lebron second unit. IT, Korver, Crowder, Love, TT third unit. Regular season should be fine. Post season will be tough to hide IT on defense. May need to trade the Brooklyn pick to get someone to help hide him/replace him.
If Cavs improve regular season, Lebron may win MVP.
Because of this trade…. I’m smelling a big year from KLOVE.
Same, I’m actually kind of excited by this. I think Cavs could play some really nice offense with good ball movement.
Me too!!! I think the offense could become more team-oriented… better passing… IT and Crowder definitely know how to move the ball. And it will be delicious to see them pass the ball and prove to Cols that his fetish with ISO ball is mistaken.
Sorry Cols, cheap shot… but just a joke LOL
IT 59th last year in REGULAR season RPM. Surprisingly, despite what we think of Irving in the regular season, he was 53rd….above IT despite the ridiculous overhype surrounding IT. I found that to be interesting considering how Irving elevates his game in the playoffs.p and we normally think of him as a net negative in the regular season.
Crowder ranked 20th in RPM in the league.
I actually think Crowder is decent unlike a lot of people around here. Defense is half the game after all.
He helps vs the Dubs. But where are you going to get that score punch from a player 5’10 or taller?
I mean they could try to flip the pick and or Thomas.
Crowder is okay, but the main reason anyone talks about him is his ripoff contract…I wouldn’t want him as a starter against the Warriors…ok bench player…
Now you’ve got IT, DRose, JR, Kyle Korver, Crowder, LBJ, TT, KLOVE, possibly DWade, and sprinkle in Jeff Green and maybe Shump gets his head out of his ass… (LOL just kidding on last one, Shump’s trash) LBJ can work with this squad this year. That’s at least 8 or 9 deep legit…. possibly 11.
IT is unplayable vs. the Warriors. Green is trash. Crowder is useful and probably the most impactful player from the trade to the Cavs. Shump is Shump. Rose can’t shoot. Calderon is off to the glue factory. Warriors in 4 or 5.
I think saying IT is unplayable vs. the Warriors is wrong. He can score, in bunches, which is definitely what you need against the Warriors. You have to score 100+ against them.
CLF. Yep.
I’m not saying the Warriors won’t win… of course they will… but LBJ with this crew, I give them a chance for sure. NEver going to say an LBJ team doesn’t have a chance. Hell, you really think this team is worse than 2007???
Child please. IT is unplayable vs GSW? Hardly. He’s a huge asset once the game gets open (as will Rose) and we are now a legit 10 deep. Plus he can actually run an offense and tries all the time. Plus we have that pick (which we could flip for another star player). We got more for Irving than the Pacers did for George or the Bulls did for Butler, and they are both much better players than Irving. The character of the team got better. The only way we could challenge GSW was for Irving’s game to grow. He… Read more »
Who does Thomas guard on the Warriors?
LeBrons Gatorade!
The pick will play great vs. the Warriors, especially in its infant stage as a pin pong ball. It can help IT guard Curry.
You hide the Pick on Zaza when he’s in the game…the Pick’s offense is more than worth the defensive liability…
https://goo.gl/images/opQfJS
http://thenewswheel.com/wp-content/themes/patterns/timthumb.php?src=http://thenewswheel.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/jerry-seinfeld-nose-pick.png&q=90&w=660&zc=1
I’m a fan of the trade because it gives us versatility. If LeBron stays, we can ship out IT and the pick to get more ammo against the Warriors. If LeBron leaves, we have a head start on a rebuild. Don’t think we could have expected better, unless the Suns parted with Jackson. (Not happening, especially since Kyrie wouldn’t commit to an extension with them).
A lot of Boston fans don’t like this trade either. Maybe it’s the sign of a fair trade when both sides feel like they got fleeced?
They definitely didn’t like the pick. That is literally the only part of this trade that might make it worth our while.
I can’t believe I’m saying this, but I’m with Cols. The thing is, IT and Crowder help LBJ THIS YEAR…. rookies aren’t helping LBJ win anything this year. Plus the pick? This is a good deal.
How does IT help this year or any year?
I view IT as a fantastic 6th man… lead scorer of a 2nd unit…. that’s tremendous guy to have in that role.
If he is willing to come off the bench, yes I agree. I doubt that is going to happen though.
Although that would mean starting rose….Yikes.
Will be an interesting question…. but I think IT and DRose in tandem minimizes the wear and tear on each of them, in a mutually beneficial situation.
Sorry, Thomas doesn’t help in the playoffs. Crowder is a glorified role player. May be a useful addition on defense.
Don’t disagree with your take on Crowder… but he’s a huge upgrade over RJ IMO
Disagree on Thomas. He can shoot, score, and get to the cup, and create… and I don’t like the guy really LOL. But I recognize the talent.
Crowder will be more impactful in the playoffs. IT will get exposed as a 5’9 PG.
Agree. Whatever Thomas contributes on offense in the playoffs, he gives up that much and more on defense.
And I just don’t see him on the court for extended minutes against Golden State without it being a disaster.
Kyire isn’t even LeBron’s greatest partner. It is pretty far down the list. Magic & Kareem. Russel & Cousy. Russel & Havlicek. MJ & Pippen. Bird + McHale. Thomas & Dumars. West & Baylor. Kareem & Oscar. James & Wade. Kobe & Shaq. Reed & Frazier. Havlicek & Cowens.
LBJ/Kyrie… One of greatest duos ever. I said it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x7QGkDBXnLA
Should be an interesting eastern conference finals next season.
We will sweep.
Boston will be better this season and they took a game from us last year. I doubt we will sweep them. We are not as good as we were last year currently constructed. We could get better by then end of the season with more moves.
Boston last year now completely irrelevant. They’ve lost Avery Bradley, IT, Crowder, Jerebko, Olynyk. Completely differnent team
They still have Brown. If forgot Bradley and olynyk were gone. They will be better. Hayward is an upgrade. Brown will be good. Irving is far superior to IT.
Hayward can’t create much and neither can Irving. I see trouble for them.
Huh????
JRL is correct. Four or five games.
CHARACTER. IT is a defensive liability, no doubt, but so is Kyrie. The performances IT put in after the death of his sister in the biggest games of his career were astounding. Entire different level of clutch than Kyrie. Real life as opposed to a cocky kid with talent staring down another millennial spoiled brat and knocking down a jumper. It’s not the size of the dog in the fight…
I guess… But unfortunately basketball is a game of skills and height(and it’s usage) is a big part of it. IT playing through the suffering was incredible and I give him props but you can’t really compare the two. If that was the case you would be wishing for a lot of tragic things to happen to basketball players to test their “character”. I like the trade given the position Kyrie put the Cavs in. I think we could had gotten something better had it not been for the “list” and his open comments of not signing an extension. With… Read more »
Preach brother, preach. 100%^ with Cols714 (and that doesn’t happen everyday). This is a great trade for the Cavs. SI gave the Cavs an A++. We got a 28 ppg scorer who is a high character guy and an all-star from Boston. We got a reliable wing defender in Crowder, who also provides some grit, on a very reasonable contract for 3 more years. We save over $26 million in tax penalties. And we land Brooklyn’s pick in next year’s daft! (Gotta be top 4, yes?). This is huge plus. We can use it to help convince James to stay,… Read more »
Count me in Jason and Brian… I agree.
This Zizic guy could be useful.
new Big Z?
Like the big man with the back-door pass out of the high post. Probably got that from Blatt.
I still miss Blatt LOL.
Other than this blog I can’t find any reputable person who thinks this is a bad trade for Cleveland.
Cavs trying to win a title…you think this trade gets them closer to that? Be honest, please.
Yes. Because IT plus Crowder>Kyrie. Especially Crowder against the warriors.
Disingenuous… you would not have said that during last year’s ECF…
Get outa my head…
Who’s the best player we’re getting? Thomas. And what is his role in the Finals against the Warriors if there’s a rematch?
Thomas may do fine in the regular season, but remember what you always say: The regular season doesn’t matter.
I cannot believe the reaction from this board. This is so much better than Bledsoe and Jackson that everyone wanted to do.
Crowder is a huge piece verse the Warriors. Thomas was even more efficient than Kyrie last year. He won’t be the #1 option so his playoff numbers will go up. And we got a super high pick to trade. This is a great haul for Kyrie.
Just wait for next year until the King say sayonara
? What does this have to do with this trade?
Unless they flip the pick for a huge talent upgrade, the pick will mean nothing to James. James knows IT’s liabilities as well as anyone as he has seen firsthand how Boston played better with IT off the floor in the playoffs.
It is not better in anyway yet and the chances are low that it will be. IT will be terrible defensively in the playoffs. That is unavoidable. The guy will never overcome his defensive liabilities. Again, IT is a huge downgrade and not playable against many lineups. Bledsoe, if healthy is better than IT. IT is the most overrated player in the league because of the regular season. We don’t know whether we will get anyone better than Jackson. The pick is only thing that might possibly make this a plus trade, but that is if we can flip it… Read more »
Plus Kyrie’s transition defense killed us in the finals. IT and Rose almost match his offense and crowder helps the D.
What are you smoking?
WHAT A BAD TRADE. GILBERT IS REALLY PUSHING LBJ ELSEWHERE NEXT YEAR.IF KYRIE IS BAD ON DEFENSE THOMAS IS WORST.
Pelton give the Cavs an A for this trade.
All depends on what happens with the pick.
Yep. The pick is most of the trade.
Nate and EG are too quiet…I smell the stench of a podcast…
YEP. Where Nate will give his hottakes and be wrong in 6 months. Or he can come out and say it was a good trade. I’m interested to see which one.
Spoiler alert: he doesn’t think it was a good trade, unless his twitter feed is a lie.
So he’s wrong again. That guy never ceases to amaze me with his takes.
I’m ready for the season to start. This off-season has been brutal.
In other news, Doug freaking Fister is one hitting the tribe through 6 while Carrasco has given up 6. Ugh.
Nice find EG! Honestly…. maybe IT will pass KLOVE the ball in the post!!! LOL
Thomas + Crowder>>>>Kyrie
Not sure about that. But Thomas + Crowder + Other Good Player We Trade BKLN Pick For > KI
Or Thomas flipped for Bledsoe or someone of that ilk plus Crowder>>>>>than Kyrie. It could end being great if they can sell Thomas as a solid building block to another team. The ship may have sailed on that though as I think the book may be out on Thomas’s real value.
Thomas is not going to be valued as high as he might no matter how good he may be because he’s due for an overpay contract, which may include some severe decline years.
You are probably right, but I can dream.
Dreams are free.
We might be able to get Rubio an Alec Burks for IT off the Jazz. They already have good defense to cover IT but not much offense.
How does the equation change if Thomas is gimped due to hip injury?
Also, I am shocked, SHOCKED to see you here praising some Cavs FO move…
My only disappointment is we should have gotten Garopolo in the deal.
#GoBrowns
Do you guys really think the IT will not be better in the playoffs when he has LeBron and Love? Do you not think that Irving is going to be worse in the playoffs when he’s the #1 option?
Who can Thomas guard in the playoffs? It’s 5 on 4 for the other team when he’s on the court. That’s…a problem.
Is it that much of a worse problem than Kyrie? Crowder plus IT, is an upgrade over Kyrie. Plus we got some eurotrash center and a super high pick we can flip for something useful.
But maybe we could still flip IT for someone like Bledsoe with some filler.
Yes, it’s more of a problem with Thomas. Kyrie didn’t care about defense during the regular season. He’d start to get interested in the early rounds of the playoffs. By the Finals he could be adequate, even good for stretches.
But if the Cavs make the Finals this year and face Golden State again, Thomas may be unplayable. Really, he was unplayable against the Cavs this year and the Celtics did better after he got hurt.
Yes I really don’t think you can hide him on defense. Irving already took more shots than James last year in the playoffs and will still have Hayward, Jaylen Brown, and a decent bench.
Agree. Will be fascinating to see KI as #1 option in playoffs. Crazy that no one mentions the LBJ effect when discussing his elite playoff performances.
To me, there is no doubt KI > IT. But the question is whether KI > IT + Crowder + Anzic + BKN pick.
Go read smart guys like Pelton. This is probably the best value we could’ve gotten for Kyrie. Yeesh. If you can’t see this and give the Cavs credit for seriously upgrading their wing depth and athleticism this offseason while getting great value for an unhappy Kyrie then I don’t know what to tell you.
Crowder is a decent player. IT is not good in the playoffs and needs to be flipped for someone that can stay on the court and not get exploited. The pick is nice if it gets flipped for a good young player. Otherwise I doubt that matters to James much. On the other hand if James is leaving maybe it turns into a rebuilding piece if….if…we get lucky with nets flailing and the ping pong balls dropping right, and if we don’t screw up royally by drafting another Anthony Bennett.
Ok. I think I’m just going to convince myself everything is great and try to enjoy whatever product we put on the court. Worst case scenario I’m going to watch the Cavs win more often than not. I’m also sticking full to the LeBron stays camp.
this is seriously a great trade for the Cavs. Plus we can flip that Nets pick for more stuff if we want.
Maybe another stiff like Jeff Green?
God this blog hates teh Cavs so much.
Yes we hate the Cavs. That’s it!
This blog doesn’t love Jeff Green as much as you do. Nobody loves Jeff Green as much as you do. If he’d signed anywhere else he’d just suck, of course.
I’m with you Cols.
What were people expecting for a 2yr rental from a guy who had a list of wanted places to work.
He literally took out 27 teams from the table. I’m just surprised Boston gave up the first round pick.
Technically we might have gotten a 1 year rental in return as his replacement. The pick likely won’t matter at all to James unless they flip it for someone ridiculous.
2 year rental….
Thought IT was up next year?
Yes.
Kyrie is, according to him, not signing a contract extension, so he’s a two year rental. If you think “two year rental” is an oxymoron, then we differ in opinions.
He also told 27 teams that he didn’t want to play for them. So… how big of a bidding war do you think really happen for his services?
If he told 27 teams he didn’t want to play for them, then there’s only 3 teams he’s willing to sign with in two years. If I’m Boston, I like those odds (says a Cavs fan living in Boston).
Other comments on this thread have pointed out some positives, but my initial thought to this trade… AWFUL.
Incidentally, the local talk here is that IT is in no-way a max player, and they were prepared for him to walk after next year.
I don’t think you like the cavs as much as you love Gilbert. Gilbert is not the cavs. Gilbert should have nothing to do with the cavs other than doing his job and doing what any small market owner that has James would do, writing checks. That guy triples the cavs value. Of course Gilbert spends to keep him happy. Big deal.
DOES AQUIRING ZIZIC MEAN WE WILL NOT SEE BIG EDDY TAVARES IN A CAVS UNIFORM ——CHECKED HIS (ZIZIC ) PRE DRAFT EVALUATIONS —SCOUTS WERE IMPRESSED WITH HIS MOTOR / ATHLETICISM / WILLING TO BANG / CAN PLAY ABOVE THE RIM —–WE SHALL SEE —-A HAPPY / HEALTHY I.T. IS MUCH BETTER THAN A MALCONTENTED KYRIE
I don’t think it matters. He wasn’t going to play anyways. He stinks!
They need to free roster spots…I’m betting that Eddy and Kay (3 million dollar man) are gone…
Malcontent for 2+ years. He would have played just fine this year.
How so? He didn’t want to be here…
Since 2015….and something happened along the way.
I’ll take a malcontent Kyrie over a midget with a busted hip.
Can’t wait to watch the midget get stuffed by Durant.
I am hoping we have suckered a chump GM into taking him and other fodder off our hands by then. Maybe Bledsoe is still possible.
Weird comment. Why not cheer for him? He seems like a good guy and there is a decent chance he will work out for us given he has a high bbiq and so do many of the Cavs. Everybody knows he is short.
For those curious, IT has averaged for his career in the playoffs 40.6% fg, 30% from 3, 54.5% TS, 22 ppg, and a net negative rating in the o/d ratings. His O rating is 107, D rating 114. His box plus minus is .6 with his obpm at 2.3 and his dbpm at -1.7. For comparison, Ky has averaged for his career in the playoffs 46.5% fg, 41.5% from 3, 57.3% TS, 23.9 ppg and has a net positive rating with an offensive rating of 117 and a defensive rating of 109. His box plus minus dwarfs IT’s measly .6… Read more »
Exactly. IT will get exposed and become unplayable. Book it!
LeBron makes everyone around him better. Yes, the height is not changeable and the 3pt shooting is weak but could Kyrie had gotten last year’s Celtics to the top seed on the East? I’m not happy with the trade but Kyrie wasn’t going to be here either way. You don’t tell Dan/LeBron to F off and still keep your job. Could we had gotten something better? I honestly don’t think so. Not with Kyrie having a “list” and saying he wasn’t going to sign an extension. Crowder is our best defender now. IT is extremely usable on the offensive end… Read more »
This doesn’t take into account the fact that Kyrie was playing with LEBRON and KLove. Isaiah Thomas was the ONLY threat on Boston. Of COURSE Kyrie had better splits. I’m not under some delusion about Isaiah Thomas and his limitations but let’s not pretend that those stats really aren’t going to improve when Isaiah Thomas is playing on the Cavs instead of with a bunch of nobodies. My wife could game plan for the Celtics last year and she didn’t start watching basketball until three years ago. Game planning for LeBron ALONE is significantly harder…
I don’t know how much LBJ was helping Irving since Ky tends to score in ISO most of the time. Certainly, teams have to pay attention to James off ball. Don’t know much about how IT plays off ball. James will still run the offense. I have no doubt. You can’t hide him on d. That is the problem. I mean Thomas’s offensive numbers were not awful. His defense just kills teams though.
Look at the Cavs splits with Kyrie on and LeBron off & compare to IT. That is your comparison.
A fair point.
Kyrie played with LeBron where opposing defenses had to pay attention to both while IT played without LeBron, so naturally the focus of opposing defense was to stifle IT.
Kyrie has always played with LeBron. Thomas has always been the #1 scorer on a team with mostly poor shooting. Any ‘objective’ evaluation that doesn’t take that into account is crazy. We got back the best scoring PG in the East who really showed some grit last year in the playoffs. I will take that guy on my team any day. Plus a hard nosed guy in Crowder on a good contract. Plus an interesting big who could (maybe?) play in Europe another year PLUS WHAT IS LIKELY THE #1 PICK IN NEXT YEAR’S DRAFT. The last is key. If… Read more »
Again his defense is the major issue that will not ever change.
Yeah mixed emotions but I’m kind of glad this is dealt with now. Am I wrong or is the season opening game CLE vs BOS ? That’s gonna be one weird moment.
Yeah is gonna be surreal.
Wide range of emotions – trying to be optimistic re: returns on trade given shortcomings of Kyrie’s game. Sad to see Kyrie go because of all the memorable moments and how fun he was to watch. Feel betrayed that Kyrie wanted nothing to do with Cleveland (and specifically LeBron) after how seemingly close the team was and how he frequently spoke of “going to war with my brothers”. Nervous about how all the pieces will fit together. SUPER EXCITED to see angry LEBRON.