The Cavaliers would land Lakers center Andrew Bynum for a package of draft picks and veteran power forward Anderson Varejao, according to one league source. The Lakers would receive Howard for Bynum. Orlando would get Varejao and draft picks. The source said this was merely the framework of a deal being discussed.
This rumor popped up about a week ago, and the fact that Ric Bucher’s reporting it indicates it may have some legs. It’s the same Bynum to CLE, Howard to LA, Varejao and picks to ORL scenario we’ve been hearing for awhile now. It’s not like this trade is imminent, but I thought I would solicit your guys’ opinions on this, since Bynum is one of those players that an economics professor would love. On the one hand, he’s the best post scorer in the league; on the other, he might get hurt. On the one hand, he’s an All-Star; on the other hand, he’s a headcase.
I would do the deal—provided the Cavs don’t give up, like, eight first-rounders or whatever—for the following reasons: a.) Cleveland is Cleveland, and if Bynum wants to re-up on his contract, he’s probably better than any other free agent the Cavs could sign; b.) there’s a 99% chance the Cavs won’t find a better center in the draft than Bynum; c.) Bynum fits nicely next to Tristan Thompson and allows TT to focus on becoming a defender, rebounder, and garbage bucket specialist; and d.) Irving and Bynum is a pretty great top two, no? Plus, it takes some of the pressure off Dion Waiters, who doesn’t have to shoulder the burden of being the Cavaliers’ second-best scorer on day one.
Your move, commenters.
This kind of deal is exactly why a team like the Cavs builds cap room and flexibility. I’m not a big Bynum fan, but there is some potential for him to grow if he’s given the keys to the franchise, with Irving. He can be ‘the man’ down low while Irving is ‘the man’ in the backcourt. No one better is coming to Cleveland on their own, so the team has to go for it so long as they don’t spend all their future draft picks. We can even take back a bad contract or two if needed and it will help fill out the roster with some (mediocre) veteran presence.
This would be only scenario that I would be ok with trading Andy. And no worries, there is literally no way Gilbert okays this deal without an extention in place. The nice thing is that Zeller, can play a bit of PF as well, with his adequate J. He plays a bit like Gasol, only obviously a billion times less good. But I fully expect Zeller to be first team all rookie. I am crazy enough to actually be watching these summer league games and dude can play. But to be perfectly honest, I would rather trade Tristan, and Zeller and picks to keep Bynum and Andy as a frontline. I don’t think it would work salary wise, but Andy’s constant activity would open things up for Bynum as much as a stretch 4 does. In any case, I think the Cavs realize that Kyrie is already really really good. Might as well start competing now
As long as we don’t lose youth in this, I’m fine with sending plenty of future picks. I’m quite attached to the youth movement we’ve started and he’d fit in perfect. If we landed Bynum, then our focus would be exclusively on player development and not trying to fill holes and stop a ship from sinking for a change. We’d just have to worry about balancing out the various talents cohesively and that would make for an exceedingly exciting team, much more versatile and dangerous than any Lebron-led team.
Love it, even though I think Bynum is a headcase. He’s one of the best centers in the league, and frankly, if he would ever focus, would probably be better than Dwight. Even at his regular, unfocused level of play though, he’s pretty good. Bynum has never had anyone passing to him like he would with Kyrie. This could be big if he buys in to giving Cleveland a shot. If he sulks though, holy hell, what a trainwreck.
If the Cavs have a chance to resign Bynum it’s a no brainer. However, if we are only going to rent him for a year, then we are out a bunch of good young assets to help build a contender around Kyrie. There is a reason that the Thunder put up with being in the Lottery for a few years while their young players grew together. It’s not like we are a title contender that needs that one big man to put them over the top. This move may make sense but in about 3-4 years from now.
This is a no-brainer as long as we do not mortgage EVERY future draft pick we have. I still can’t believe Bynum would even want to come here after playing in LA. I know he said we were on his list, but that was only because he figured about 4 teams could even afford to sign him to a max deal next year, and we happen to be one of them. Anyway, give up 2-3 first rounders, maybe throw in another 1-2 second rounders, and Andy. There are only so many people we can play on the court and pay at the same time… Bynum, TT, hole (a.k.a. Gee), Waiters, Irving. You could fill that hole with just about anyone, including myself, and still have a decent chance at winning. It takes some pressure of Zeller and allows him more minutes against the opposing reserves, they could sign Flynn as a backup PG, who should be capable if healthy, and fill the rest of the team with some modest FA signings. That starting 5 should be incredibly competitive. We’d have to build out bench up… Also, what if we made the trade then re-signed Jamison as a backup…. Wouldn’t be a bad scorer against reserves when Irving and Bynum were off the floor.
Think – we would have the 1,2,4 and 5 filled. And, LeBron can opt out soon… Just sayin’. Think Bynum, TT, LBJ, Waiters, Irving and a few other pieces in another 2 years or so… Don’t tell me LBJ wouldn’t come back to play with that 4, and also the first person who says they don’t want LBJ back, save your breath – you’re an idiot. And Gilbert is a businessman, he’d see what that would mean…
Oh well, Jamison just signed with the Lakers, I was a few minutes too early…
I don’t want LBJ back (used my fingers instead of my breathe hole).
1. Only if he signs an extension.
2. Varejao plus 2 1st rd picks – yes!
3. Varejao plus Thompson plus 4 picks – no
Its the somewhere between 2 and 3 where it gets murky.
Bynum to Cavs puts us in play for a 5-6 seed THIS SEASON. The extension is the hangup for sure. Also, I’m not sure how Byron Scott’s coaching style would mesh with Bynum’s immaturity. At the very least, we’re over .500 with Irving and Bynum (and a few filler FA moves).
From what I understand neither Bynum or Paul would benefit from signing an extension. I don’t know the exact numbers but its something like that this year they can only sign for 3 years and $60 million but after the season they can sign with their team (Lakers, Cavs, whoever) for 5 years and about $100 million, so unfortunately I don’t think any of us would sign an extension if those were the options…. Guessing a little wink wink nudge nudge agreement or at least discussion will take place.
I don’t think the same is true for Howard, not sure why. Someone running this site connected to ESPN could probably get some good people on the question.
Dan I like your thinking. We could even fill the hole at the 3 with Richardson or turkoglu if needed. We can handle 1 bad contract for that kind of talent. Perhaps in exchange for giving up fewer picks. And you’re right, lbj in a few years once wade breaks down could happen. And most fans would love it despite what they say. We would definitely have to make a signed extension a necessary condition for a deal.
I’d love this trade but I’m not sure what ORL gets out of it that they ain’t getting out of HOU. And Howard won’t commit to LAL (at least until BRK are out of the race) so this is a non-starter until the trade deadline IMHO.
So many ACRONYMS…
If he wants to sign an extension, absolutely, no questions asks. Even with Bynum’s somewhat bad attitude and questionable knee, he’s a guy that the Cavaliers should be pushing extremely hard to get. With the thinking around the league that Kyrie is going to become a superstar very, very soon, tagging him together with a force down low who has the ability to dominate on a nightly basis is a no-brainer. The reason Cleveland should covet Bynum so much is that his talent level is so much higher than the other 5′s in the league (other than Dwight of course, even though during last season there were debates that he was better than D12).
Obviously you don’t want to give up too much. But pairing Kyrie and Bynum together and figuring it out from there is a fantastic idea. If you lose Tristan or Zeller in the process, so be it. I’d be willing to give up 2 future first rounders plus one of them for Bynum (plus I like the ceiling of Waiters, even though I may be the only one).
This makes me wish we’d gone after some guys in free agency… I also think Harrison Barnes on this team fits much better than Dion Waiters. That being said, it’s not a bad gamble. Bynum is not signing an extension. He makes a lot more as a free agent, but it gives us the best bet to sign him. And The Lakers want this to happen. How killer of a team is Nash, Kobe, Artest, Gasol, and Dwight?
Go for it. In the perfect world where Good Alonzo and Good Boobie come to town next fall, and Waiters shows that he can put up an efficient 15 points per game, the Cavs could be a contender right away.
I still think the Cavs/Lakers/Magic deal is a smokescreen and Hennigan is trying to pit Morey against this deal to shed more bad contracts.
I’m all for the deal if the Cavs trade Varejao, two first round picks and the Magic’s own second round picks in 2013 and 2014. Cleveland would probably also take on two of the Magic’s undesirable contracts. Maybe Chris Duhon and Q. Richardson.
a week ago people were saying the cavs are becoming really irritating to deal with and all that. GOOD! A little warm fuzzy that they aren’t going to get fleeced.
Bynum is injury prone, had a bad attitude, and can be Dwight or Darko on any given night. There are a ton of red flags. But I guess all that is trumped by the fact that he’s probably the 2nd best center in the league right now. Also, he’s a legit center with an ACTUAL POST GAME that can play with his back to the basket.
I’m surprised everyone is so content with verbal assurances that he would resign – are you all too young to remember Carlos Boozer?
I’ve never liked Bynum’s attitude and his knee makes this a VERY risky trade. I also hate the fact that we’re giving up our second best player and two future picks for him. That being said, he is very talented and is a guy that I’d like to see the Cavs get.
Worst case scenario: Cavs don’t do well this season, Bynum signs else where, we’re out two first rounders and a great defensive player, Cavs start all over again. It’s a VERY risky trade.
I would be thrilled with this, if the Cavs are guaranteed a Bynum extension. He is the second-best center in the league, and he is only 24. That is nearly priceless. Andy is getting old, and next year’s draft is weak anyways.
I think a couple of people have touched on why this will not work. My biggest concern is Bynum’s attitude. If the Zen master couldn’t keep this guy motivated and on track, and Coach Scott showed he had no patience for attitudal sand baggers like J.J. Hickson, what makes anyone think this would end any way but with dissapointment?
If there’s a Bynum extension, it’s a good deal. As nice as draft picks are, the sad reality is that once you get outside of the Top 10 picks or so, you’re usually happy to get a solid-but-unspectacular starter…and with second rounders, you’re typically lucky to even get a solid guy off the bench.
Of course, it should go without saying that you do NOT do the deal unless Bynum signs an extension as part of the trade (essentially a year-early sign-and-trade).
Also, whoever suggested the wink-wink, nudge deal, that would be either unenforceable (if Bynum changed his mind next year) and/or a major violation of NBA rules against under-the-table agreements.
I would like to state for the record, that Bynum is worth it but he is not worth us going all in with rediculous draft picks being given away. Tyler Zeller is and will be a stud. Not average but above average. To package him in a trade is dummm plain dummmm. Now pair Zeller as PF and Bynum as C and that will crush teams with the twin towers cuz Zeller know the game high IQ. A true twin towers. TT and Andy can go cuz I like the sound of the twin towers better. Tyler can run the floor better than any big man and while he running down the floor he can play center till Bynum slow butt catch up and get back in position to punish the opposing team. I think Cleveland would be a great fit for Bynum cuz then he could be a mentor and leader which then make him play better cuz he now would have people looking up to with such a young core. Dion Waiter will be a stud to much talent and confiedence and body control. Hell LBJ couldnt shoot a jumper either but with tyme and practice he now makes them….
with that lineup we wouldn’t NEED LBJ
Obviously I would make this trade, even if we had to give up Andy, the Kings pick, and 2 of our first rounders (even though I seriously doubt we would give up that much- we’d probably just take back a bad contract instead of giving picks). The NBA is a star-driven league, and if you have stars good role players will take a pay cut just to play there. Look at Miami, Boston, both LA teams, and even the Spurs and Thunder.
With Irving and Bynum we could very easily have the best center and best point guard on the same team. That makes them a contender as long as they’re not playing with Flynn, Casspi, and Harangody. If Waiters becomes a solid third option, they’ll have great role players in TT, Zeller, Gee, and others to make a serious run.
All of this is contingent on Bynum signing an extension, but the Cavs would be title contenders with this acquisition.
One other thing about Waiters and his “struggles” in Summer League. While his shot hasn’t been falling, he has been creating good looks at the basket, just not finishing. If that sounds familiar, it’s because the same thing was happening to Kyrie at the beginning of his rookie season. While I’m not suggesting that Waiters is in the same discussion as Irving, I don’t think his lackluster numbers should be any cause for concern.
The thing is if we get him on a one year rental under the new CBA we can offer him a lot more money than anyone else next summer. Thats part of the reason D12 wants to get traded so bad. We would have a good team and I don’t think he’s a big fan of LA. He vacations in Alaska maybe he wouldn’t hate Cleveland. So even if we don’t get an extension I would be ok with trading TT or AV and 2 picks as long as one of them isn’t ours. Brooklyn will not be able to offer him a contract next summer unless they unload some untradable contract aka wallace, JJ, or brook lopez
Bynum has had his episodes with immaturity, but he’s also had to grow up in the shadows of Shaq, Kareem, Wilt, Mikan, etc. Kobe publicly called for him to be traded. Some players aren’t built for the pressures of a major market. Bynum already has a relationship with Scott and Scott wouldn’t be afraid to challenge him.
You do it because you’d automatically have the best center in the East and probably the best PG/C combo in the league. Where will he defect to? All of the other cosmopolitan free agent destinations are capped out. Would Bynum walk away from 25 million to play in Dallas with 34 year-old Dirk? Phoenix to play with Michael Beasley and cheap ass Robert Sarver?
And allow me to take this opportunity to gloat over TRob struggles in the summer league and Henson’s brilliant debut game. As of now, I am a genius. Here’s hoping that continues! Haha!
Btw, gotta do Bynum trade (and how stupid is Bud Shaw for saying the Cavs shouldn’t do it?)…
Oh and i read from two different sources today that Bynum has a relationship w/Scott and it is a very positive one. FWIW…
The only way I’d be for trading Andy is for a legit all-star caliber player, and Bynum is that. Though I have doubts about his dedication, he coachability (I’ll take all the 3′s I want), his head (that shot on Barea was one of the dirtiest plays I’ve ever seen), and his injury history. That said, I’d still be in IF
1) Only if we have an extension in hand.
2) If no extension, then I’d only be willing to part with Walton/Casspi/Boobie + a pick or two (not ours).
3) With the extension, I’d be willing to give up more picks, and Andy/Tristan, but not both, and I’d be willing to take on a bad contract or two (Turk/JRich/Big Baby etc).
If push came to shove, I’d rather trade Tristan and keep Andy.
So the way I’ve heard it on espn is that we would deal Andy first, get a trade exception, then deal a bunch of picks and walton for Bynum and a TON of expiring contracts in Orlando. I dont think Tristan is even on the table here. In order for this to be done, Bynum would have to be totally locked up to an extension. For those of u saying u don’t want lebron… Quit trolling yourself. He’s Easily the best player in the world. That being said, don’t hold ur breath on him returning… Not Gunna happen.
Right now i would like to thank james for leaving….. giving up andy v. and walton(no one really cares if he leaves) along with say the cavs 1st rounder next year and one of those heat 1st rounders along with 1 or 2 2nd round picks for bynum and the bad contracts of lets say turk and richardson…..after all this is over we could have a starting line up of Pg. Irving Sg. Dion Sf. turk (only cause i like gee off the bench) Pf triston C bynum with gee the 6th man than also have zeller and omri and johny flyn (if they can sign him) coming off the bench that team i would say can become a 5 to 7 seed and win the first series depending on who they play…. but they would still have a lot of picks in upcoming drafts trade these picks to get a better sf either by drating higher or via a trade but for a younger player eventually 2 or 3 years from now you could be looking at a big 3 with a strong sappourting cast a team we never could dream of if james had never left the cavs
http://queencityhoops.com/blog/2012/07/18/breaking-bobcats-rescind-qualifying-offer-to-derrick-brown/
Someone cheap with athleticism at a position of need?
Wait now…. everyone is STILL hung up on draft picks?
Listen up kids – we’re not hanging around the lottery for the next three years. If we do, forget about winning for the near and far forseeable future. We’re two years into tank mode now – great, but if, two years from now, we’re still at the bottom of the barrel, I’d be very concerned about Kyrie sticking around. Furthermore the moment teams hang around the lottery for more than the minimum required, situations quickly turn into SAC/GS/MIL/MN etc. etc. etc.
Are there seriously people out there who feel it’s not worth while to trade the 2013/2015/2017 (lottery protected on the last) picks plus Andy for the second best center in the NBA? Do you guys even watch basketball????? Like I’ve been saying for, I dunno, two years, you have MAYBE a 1/4 shot of hitting the mark on an NBA draft pick. That’s for a MEDIOCRE starter. Bynum is a top 20 player in the NBA. And you’d rather keep picks for what? A chance at a top 20 player?
I don’t understand why everyone is so fearful of getting better. If Waiters/TT don’t pan out, we’re back to square one. If we get Bynum, those picks become SUBSTANTIALLY more irrelevant.
I don’t care what trade is used as long as it gets done. Get Bynum to the Cavs. Look, the cap room and assets the Cavs have are set up to allow a situation like this to happen. Draft picks are great to have. The thing is, not many picks turn out to become the 2nd best C in the NBA. So you people seem to want to test one’s luck at the draft, rather than getting a sure thing? What will keep Kyrie in Cleveland? His hopes of getting a good lottery pick, or the FO making moves to surround him with the elite players that are available?
We all know what happened last time. Don’t make the same mistake CLE.
LETS GO CAVS!
Look guys, Bynum is stud and the numbers he put up last yr in a grueling season without being injured was a site to see and I hate every other team but my CAVS..With that being said AV is getting older and anybody that was on the team when LBJ was there is not worth keeping around. Waiter is going to be a beast. I watched him and all college games this yr hard. Melo is solid and Waiters is better. Body control is stupid crazy. He will be a super star like KI and both of them play similiar and if u didnt know two guards like PArker and Ginobily equal great passing and scoring, well we got two also so dont look down on Waiter cuz u must remember the 5-15 is not he just miss 10 shot but went to the line and drawn the fouls and so thats not bad and he will get better and better and he may be the rookie of the yr with KI help and his own will to prove he was the 4 pick worthy. Now this my line up
Line up
G KI…SG DW…SF Richardson….PF Zeller….C Bynum now thats a fight for any team cuz they yung and hungry and talented and will make everybody look good
The bit I would point out here is that while AV is at the top of his trade value, he’s also frequently underrated because he doesn’t score a lot of points. I’m not saying don’t sell him, but don’t sell him too cheaply either. Hollinger’s PER makes AV worth basically Chris Bosh, and last year his rebounds per 48 was third in the NBA, and Wins Produced actually thinks AV has been better recently than either Howard or Bynum.
Statistically speaking: AV is worse at defensive rebounds than Howard, but better than both Howard and Bynum at offensive rebounds, overall ranking in between the two. AV is much better at not turning the ball over and stealing, but not as good at blocking or avoiding fouls. AV scores far less than either Bynum or Howard, but (depending on how you measure) makes up for it in other aspects of his game. And drawing offensive fouls isn’t kept as a statistic. It’s not at all clear from the numbers that getting either Howard or Bynum for Varejao necessarily improves the team all that much.
I seem to be in the minority here….I’m not in favor. The headcase thing is a part of it; injury history is a part of it. If it’s a deal somewhere like Varejao and a 1st rounder, I guess I could stomach it. I’d want no part of it if we have to give up Zeller or TT.
Here’s my beef- people are looking at Bynum as a 24-year old who has been steadily improving, and see another 4 years of improvement before he hits his peak….that timeline is DEAD WRONG. In the NBA- especially for big men- the production curve isn’t about the age….it’s about the MILEAGE.
The proper growth trajectory for an NBA big coming out of high school is Jermaine O’Neal. It went something like this: rode the pine first two years, gained playing time and experience for the next 3-4 years, peaked in year 7, and played at that level for about two years. Since year 8, his minutes and production have declined every year since. He hasn’t played a full season since 2004. He keeps landing with contenders because they are saying “hey, he’s 33 years old, he’s got something left in the tank.” But if you look at his stats, he should have retired three years ago.
This coming year will be Bynum’s 8th year in the NBA. The sad truth is, there’s only so much pounding a 7-footer’s knees and back can handle (witness Dwight Howard- I pity the fools that mortgage the farm for him). If we acquire Bynum now, we’ll be getting him at his peak….and he’ll be in decline as Kyrie is still in his growth years. I’d rather have Zeller and Thompson growing with Kyrie at the same pace.
Not a big fan.